As you all know, the TBB family is enjoying the Westin resort at Blue Mountain in Ontario Canada. Our loft suite is fantastic and view is amazing. No snow but we knew that coming in, we just wanted to get away for a weekend!
As expected, not much is happening in the blogoshpere. We expected the weekend to be boring but even we were surprised but how boring it is! We haven’t found a single post to feature! We thought about featuring here yet another boring interview by MMS, yet another first class “they are all starting to look the same now” trip report by Ben (TBB is boycotting his site until he starts posting wet towel pics again!), Gary’s blogging machine keeps carrying on but no earth shattering news, lots of Black Friday promo stuff (we here at TBB have NEVER participated in this madness, we are crazy but not THAT crazy). Delta Points even tried to push the crapiola Barclay’s Black card, what is next, Spirit’s card?
Someone on twitter accused TBB of posting a filler post yesterday. My friend, that was NOT a filler post, it had the best stuff we found the previous day (which remains this blog’s mission, we think…we actually don’t know what the mission is, we just keep making it up as we go along!). Today is a true filler post instead:-)
If you are interested to find out what is happening in this hobby (note: it is not a hobby for most anymore, it has become a big business!) you should read this article that appeared in the InaCents blog recently:
Chase is Officially No Longer in the InACents Wallet
Some excerpts (yes, we admit, this was prepared this some time ago, hey give us a break, they all have filler posts all the time! They can pop out a cc filler post in less than 5 mins & make quite a bit of money…so please do not bitch so much at us here, thanks…not that we care too much anyway).
When I began down the journey of blogging, I was fascinated by finance and travel as topics. [ TBB’s founder is still fascinated by the same two subjects! There was a brief thought of starting a blog combining these two passions and calling it M&M, as in Money & Miles but we thought it may come up way too often when people were looking for S&M…and we just did not want to go there:-)]
I had no idea what InACents would become, or what I would even write about. [ Same here!]
At the beginning, I knew very little, if anything, about affiliate programs. Over time, as we began to monetize the site, we started to learn about affiliate programs and the products we could offer to our readers, while first hand experiencing the merchants products. [I still know very little. Their non transparency is sure giving me the creeps though. What is this, the online Amway or what??]
That is where credit cards fit a perfect piece of the InACents puzzle, straddling both our finance and travel topics. So we worked with an affiliate company to be able to offer Discover, American Express, and lastly Chase products to our readers. [ I guess this is how it begins…]
I did not want InACents to become a credit card pushing website, throwing it in the audiences face in each and every post. [ Nooooo, you don’t say!! Really!!! This is what is happening now folks…I told you that this was getting good, you may ask for more filler posts like this now:-)]
No offense to the other mileage blogs, many that came along even after us, but they are non-stop whores to the credit card companies. [A blogger got offended once for calling him out on his relentless “pimping” of chase credit cards. That was a bad choice of words. Let’s start calling it for what it really is now…how about “whores to the credit card companies”…Hey, I did NOT say that, one of your own did!]
Over the summer it became all too apparent to me why other travel blogs are pushing credit cards in each and every post. [ I have been watching this trend for several years, it has intensfied lately!]
I was totally caught me off guard when I received a message from our affiliate company that our relationship with Chase was being discontinued due to being a low volume affiliate. [ Aha! There is a minimum quota to achieve here? Is this the reason for the barrage of cc posts we are being inflicted upon?]
That means that Chase was no longer happy with affiliates selling a handful of credit cards each month. Chase wanted higher numbers of new applications. Now that explains why other bloggers are constantly pushing credit cards in everyone’s face. [Wait, I think I just said that]
Now keep in mind, the bloggers, me included, get paid nicely in most cases to promote credit cards. At the same time though, Chase is the cause of the problem by setting minimum sales standards. [I feel a rant is coming shortly from this blogger against Chase and the affiliate company]
The things that really bother me are:
1) InACents consistently sold Chase products each and every month. That is why we gave a tremendous amount of thanks to those readers that chose to utilize our links to apply for credit cards. While I can not disclose specifics, the number of sales was significant to the operation of this website, allowing us to develop the site further.
2) Chase (or my affiliate manager) gave absolutely no notification of this new threshold that affiliates had to meet. No warnings, or friendly emails stating we would like more sales. Just a simple email saying our relationship is over. Where was the thank you for selling their product for several months?
[Face it, you were just not a good enough whore! “You gave a tremendous amount of thanks”? How? By saying “we sure appreciate it if you click here” or by buying them coffee? I told you this blogger is getting mad now…crying out “not fair”. This only leads to big getting bigger which also bothers me in general! But that’s another rant post I guess]
So now all of a sudden, a third of InACents credit card affiliate partners says goodbye. [It may be a third but the other banks pay crap compared to Chase, why don’t you tell us what portion of your income was coming from Chase? They still pay the highest bonuses! How do I know? Well, I have sources imbedded in these institutions who talk to me. Or I just sit down and put two and two together….When was the last time you saw a Discover credit card pushed? Yes Amex products are still pushed but not as hard as before. Bluebird…had to say that, I hear it improves hit counts, lol]
The whole thing stinks of greed, and will make the rich bloggers richer and give the start-ups no chance at success. [ No comment here! That stinking greed is responsible…Really? Shocking!]
A handful of sales is better than no sales. [He would jump back in it in a heartbeat if they took him back!]
However, everyone needs to realize the greed Chase is pushing on their affiliates to sell, sell, sell. [Not sure if this is getting funny now or really sad…What a revelation that Chase is doing this, lol!]
I understand promoting and encouraging more sales, but to punish those that do not sell enough is wrong in my opinion. [What a cry baby. Will work on a “what’s wrong” post eventually]
Know that InACents will not become like the other travel hacking blogs. We will not consistently push credit cards in each and every post. [ oh oh, I think we may see more Discover cards pushed on this site now, lol. If there is one thing we absolutely despise around here, it is this consistent push for credit cards in almost every other post! To my readers: Start counting such posts and create a log and get a credit card from the blogger who provides good content AND is doing the less pushing! Not that it would make any difference at all in this practice. Well, I hope it does so we can make this a little better place as it is quickly approaching mega whore levels! Or perhaps I should start a “Top 10 Bloggers to never get a credit card from” list? Maybe this the way to monetize my blog, have a price affixed to avoid me placing you on that list. As my hits increase, the price will go up. Is this brilliant or what? I wonder if any blogger took this seriously. If yes, I can refer you to my therapist, YOU need her!]
“…we will continue to maintain a balance so as not to flood the site with credit cards and become the card issuers puppets. “ [I think this blogger may have some guilty feelings! Bloggers who push them credit cards so much, don’t you feel like a puppet when you look yourself in the mirror in the morning? We all know you should get paid for your work, only idiots do it for free ( idiot TBB)! If you disclose the arrangement in a clearly visible AND VERY close to the scene of the crime (sorry, click) it is fine. If you bury it in tiny font somewhere in the website where visitors will almost never go to read…well, what can I say, shame on you! Yes, you satisfied the legal requirements laid out by lawyers. But, imho, it is not the right thing to do. Hey, it is my opinion, buzz off! Of course, adding cautionary language about NOT carrying a balance is too much as that may jeopardize your acceptance in this nice club. Ok, I better stop, I am feeling that I am losing it again]
Once Chase learns not to bite the hand that feeds them, maybe we will consider adding them back into our lineup at a future date. [ I think this blogger is still pissed off about it.]
This is a funny piece on credit card blogger pimps and whores.
This was good to read after reading Gary Leff’s piece this morning “Hilton HHonors Double Elite Credit Promotion – And why it holds no interest for me at all” where he states:
“I can’t imagine earning Hilton’s status based on nights or stays.”
and
“First of all, Gold is the best HHonors status to have and not Diamond (considering tradeoffs).”
Then Gary pushes the Hilton credit card for HHonors Gold status for travelers who don’t actually want to stay at Hilton hotels unless there is no other option.
Good find, nice article and rant review.
TBB, of all the interviews that MMS has done, have you ever added even one of those bloggers to your reader list to follow? Zip.
TBB, how long before your interview shows up on MMS? He’ll get to you before the end of the year.
@Ric: Thanks for the comment!
@3LeftTurns: I have added EVERY blogger that has appeared in MMS interviews in my Google Reader! I was offered an interview by MMS as soon as I posted my first post. I respectfully declined. Based on MMS wide readership, I may be an idiot. No, I am an idiot for refusing:-)
@Ric: LOL, earlier today I commented on the exact same thing about gleff in his blog post. His blog post title attracts your attention so you go there and all it is is him making yet another excuse to push a credit card. The guy is turning into a complete and utter credit card pimping whore, he has no shame. He’s almost as bad as MMS!!! At least the 2 of them allow comments and let readers call them out of their absurdness, more than I can say for clowns like DeltaPoints.
Oh man, be sure to read MMM’s blog post here http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2012/06/21/i-just-gave-up-4000-per-month-to-keep-my-freedom-of-speech/
I have always been very curious about the amount of money these bloggers get for pushing the cards. MMM gets the closest to finally telling it like it is.
And, MMS, if you ever need another blog post idea, why not do a little recon on how much these guys are making off their cc pushing? 🙂
Oops, I did not mean MMS in the above, but TBB. (Time to lay off the liquor….)
@gregorygrady: Well, I hope the article I heavily commented on today lays out this “issue” pretty nicely. I take a deeper angle on this based on what I do for a living. I am certain many consumers are reeled in this hobby & credit card churning who are just NOT qualified and they are the ones who get burned to allow this practice to be so profitable for so many parties. I do not have numbers to back this up. My gut instict says it is so. We may never know for sure. Then it becomes an issue how hard bloggers push this stuff on their readers. Well, you know the biggest pushers. And then there are others who avoid insulting our intelligence such as Frequent Miler or Rapid Travel Chai who almost never even bring it up! And then there are others like Loyalty Traveler and Wandering Aramean who just do not go there. These will always have the highest regard from us for being so strong to resist the easy $$. It comes down to a combination of ethics and business decision. It is so darn HARD to come up with quality content, I have learned that in my very short stint as a blogger already! Anyway, this is developing I guess
@bluecat: Actually, I am not joking here, the MMM article was going to be my filler post for tomorrow. But somehow the cat was let out of the bag prematurely. Oh well…
This is another area that I do not like about this practice. It is so darn NON-TRANSPARENT. I think consumers should KNOW how much a provider of a service or product makes if they complete a transaction. And this must absolutely happen in a financial transaction because the room for shenanigans and conflict of interest is IMMENSE! We are trying to get financial advisors to become fiduciaries but the brokerage/banking/insurance is fighting us tooth and nail. Even if we succeed (long shot), we doubt that this affiliate cc link money machine will stop. So, we are left to guessing what the cut is for each player. I think MMM was on the low side. I think some of the top bloggers make A LOT more. Again, no hard numbers to back this up. Just instinct;-)
A few thoughts from me on this never-ending topic…
1) The reference to Mr Moustache blog… yeah all sounds nice, but then if you go to his credit card pages, he pimps crappy cards like the 30k US Air sign up. So far from perfect. He’s more like Delta Points pimping the crappiest of crap deals (DP I think you are a nice guy but your site pimping is horrible)
2) It is really sad to see how Gleff went over a cliff with credit cards. His blog was what I considered by far the best, and is now pretty much the worst, now he has really bad credit card pimping. The post mentioned about the Hilton Reserve is not as bad as his first posts on this. He had a post which harped on about how wonderful the new card was and hey it didn’t even pay an affiliate commission. And then lo and behold a couple of days later, an affiliate link magically appeared. Like he didn’t know it was coming. I challenged him once to go a month without a credit card pimp post, he just got all upset about it. I doubt he could actually go a week. And even the commentary post are now annoying as seems he has to post about anything and everything. Presumably to ensure traffic stays high so indirectly these are pimp posts too.
3) For all the heat on MMS, he does the BEST job of laying out affiliate deals. If there is a better deal out there, he tells you straight up. Take for example the recent Citi deals, which if you read between the lines are clearly the result of the recent blogger meet up at Citi headquarters where the bloggers complained that they could not compete with zombie app pages. MMS is the ONLY guy out there who puts it out in bold and capital letters that there are better offers out there. If you are stupid enough to still use his affiliate links after that, you deserve to have the money taken from your pocket. I don’t always agree with MMS style and I find the endless husband and wife pictures as annoying as the next guy but I think he leads the way in handling credit card deals which ultimately is the best and easiest way to play this game
4) George I appreciate your fine and dandy morals on the subject, but fact is people have to be able to fend for themselves. If someone “can’t handle” a credit card it is not a blogger’s fault. I don’t see any bloggers saying you should get cards and carry balances, pay them late, rack up spending. Again MMS does a very good job of spelling out in very easy to follow terms how to build up spend without actually spending. People need to take responsibility for their own actions. When everyone assumes that someone else will lead the way for them they don’t necessarily end up in the right place, just look at Greece lol
5) Commission disclosure? Are you kidding me? This country does not have commission disclosure on just about any financial product other than I think mortgages. Insurance? No f’in way! On funds the methods of calculation are so complex that you can never actually work it out. The chances of commission disclosure are zero
6) The amount to be made is huge. Let me stick with MMS. He has 7,500 subscribers (great job by him on building that up btw). Let’s say he gets 10% of them to sign up to say Citi Hilton Reserve, Ink Bold and Chase Saphirre each. That’s $450,00 off the bat assuming they pay $200 each which I am sure they do. I just hope he saves a good part of it as personally I think there is very little chance the banks are recovering their acquisition costs and the numbers WILL go down
7) On that note the smartest kid on this street is by far TPG Points Guy. He is really broadening his appeal into a more mainstream media product that will survive simple card affiliate income.
sorry for taking up so much space lol
@MilesAbound: Thanks a lot for your thoughts which are very similar to me!
1) Ditto on MMM. He actually has some advice which is awful. But he does not portray himself to be a miles expert so that 30k US Air card offer could be excused. I agree on DP, great guy & awful cc pimping. I will not go easy on him:-)
2) I mostly agree on Gary Leff’s blog too. He had the BEST blog by for years. Over the past year you see the cc effect. He still provides decent content compared to the competition and compared to some other cc pushers he may be considered an idol of responsible cc pushing (if there is such a thing). A whole month without cc pushing? That will happen the day full dollar commissions are disclosed…yep, never! He does get pretty touchy on the comments. I mean, he was all over me. I found it very honoring…I mean, he is the great Gary L. and I am this minion blogger without even two weeks under my belt! I still don’t know how he does everything he does and I am determined to never wake up at 5 am like him:-)
3) I agree on MMS. He does lay it out nicely AND the kid has talent writing and explaining in great detail (as much as we veterans do not like this). The newbies love him. Heck, I go there and read his stuff when I get lazy:-) And the way he has built his site is amazing. He must come clean and announce he no longer has any student loans, college funds for two kids are set and mansion is paid in cash LOL.
4) I have been fighting for the fiduciary standard in financial services. Not here yet, but it is coming. The SEC number 1 is leaving, she was a shill for the big banks and stopped the momentum. Elizabeth Warren is trying to get into the Senate Banking committee. Of course people need to be responsible. But, studies indicate, people do not understand this stuff and the implications. Bloggers should at least provide cautionary language in Bold and large font a LOT more than just “credit is your most important asset” copout language. This is a VERY long and complicated subject. I would be fine with full disclosure:-) And please do not get me started on Greece. It is a tragedy indeed and I am living it as I have family there!
5) Ok, I agree on commissio disclosure. Likely won’t happen in our lifetime. But the disclosure that there IS a financial arrangement should appear NEXT to the cc app link and not buried in a place in tiny font nobody will find, let alone read.
6) Yes, the money is huge. If I only had started this instead of sitting on my butt for so many years:-)
7) Yes, Brian TPG is the smartest. He is the number 1 in this field. His PR is amazing. He probably does not need to get into Paypal and Green dot cards though:-)
Thanks again!
Well at least it is interesting discussion 🙂
I don’t even think disclosure will fix anything anyway. Cigarette packets have “THESE THINGS WILL F*ING KILL YOU MORON” written on them (well something like that) and people still smoke them anyway. The more intelligent amongst us know who the credit card whores are and just don’t use them.
Yeah odd for TPG to still be messing around with Paypal and Greendot when Chase is funding him to fly around the world. His future is ThePointsGuy TV channel not peeing around with dorks like us lol
Working on blog post for tomorrow. I think it comes down to doing this activity with class, the full disclosure thing I mean. As a former smoker who has not touched a cigarette in 11 years…I used to read that scary language and it took a toll on me…seriously!
It was sure odd to see TPG mess with PP and GD! But it must have something to do with SEO? Maybe it is like the Bluebird term which is very desirable from what I hear! Him and MMS are amazing in this SEO stuff!
Bluebird
🙂
Wow very nice blog with the great post. Thank for sharing this post.
vietnam tours
Thank you Mr. Bond!
Ric, I don’t follow your logic as to why Gary’s post was so… whatever. I agree 100% with Gary’s logic all the way through. The advice he dispenses in that post matches EXACTLY what I’d tell a friend to do (in fact, when I first saw news of the Hilton promo elsewhere, those were my exact thoughts: “Why should I stay at Hilton to get status when I can just get it through a CC?”) and I get no CC commission. Hilton Gold status has been extremely valuable to me for my occasional Hilton stays. What’s the issue exactly??